What is Delta 8? With Kylee Shumway | Be Informed. Be Well.

What is Delta 8?

Join Kylee Shumway and John Malanca to find out.

Kylee Shumway is a Pharmacist in Charge at WholesomeCo.

She has a Doctorate of Pharmacy from Roseman University of Health Sciences with 6+ years of clinical experience specializing in compounding pharmacy, bio-identical hormone replacement therapy, and now specializes in Medical Cannabis at WholesomeCo where she oversees a team of pharmacists.

Find out how cannabis is used as medication from a pharmaceutical perspective.

Visit WholesomeCo:

https://www.wholesome.co/

#cannabis #pharmacist

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Transcript

John Malanca  0:01 
Welcome back John Malanca here with United Patient Group Be Informed.  Be Well. I'm really excited because I have a guest on here Kylee Shumway but we've actually been off video talking for about an hour here so excited to to get back on I said we better just start filming but Kylie Good to see you How are you doing?

Kylee Shumway  0:21  
I am so good it's so good to be here thank you for having me.

John Malanca  0:25  
Well you'll love her energy everyone so it's okay to reach I have Kylee on here Kylee is a pharmacist and I truly believe that pharmacists need to be more involved and I love it that the the younger pharmacists are coming on board and and leading the way and I want to say young you know you've been a pharmacist for six years and so you've seen a lot you know a lot can you share your out of Utah you with an organization called wholesome CO and it's one of the first dispensaries cannabis dispensaries and because Utah we've done a lot of work with YUTAN it used to be a CBD only law state. And so now THC is available for patients. And so you work in the actual dispensary. It's a beautiful dispensary. But you work in this country to help patients because not a one size fits all. You know, you should look at age weight, current health condition, but also sensitivities and drug to drug interactions. And so you're in there talking with patients giving guidance, protocols, dosing, etc. And so little have a little background on you, Kylee.

Kylee Shumway  1:29  
So I graduated in 2016. But I had been interested in cannabis for much longer than that. My dad got sick when I first got into pharmacy school, and he got cancer. And he was wasting away. He was not the chemo was killing him faster than it was killing his cancer. And my mom and I decided we were going to take him out of state because at the time it was illegal in Utah to have cannabis. And we were going to treat him without telling us doctors. And we did. And if he totally turned around, he started eating again. He gained weight. So he gained all this weight back. He's about six, five. And he was 180 pounds when we decided it was time. And he got back to up to his normal weight. He was probably 230 pounds when he got back up to his normal weight. And it was just that moment of like, I want to do this for somebody. And I'm in pharmacy school and I I could do this and I would tease my boyfriend at the time that I was good. He better be ready to move out of state because I was going to be a cannabis pharmacist. So that was that's kind of way back my way back background. Wow. But I did stay in Utah. And I became a compounding pharmacist much more interested in the way into I wanted to do individualized medicine I didn't want to do this big box. Everybody gets Prozac type of medicine. I wanted individual patients individualized medicine. And now in cannabis I get to do that here in Utah. In Utah, every dispensary has to have a pharmacist. And every patient is required to meet with the pharmacist the first time and I can go over their disease states. And then I can ask them, you know, their goals for treatment. And then I can help them find realistic goals for cannabis because it's not a panacea. It is not the answer for every single patient but it is the answer for a whole lot of people. So that's kind of where my passion lies is this educating patients, educating providers and educating the public even if you're never going to use cannabis, you should be educated on it as well. As someone in your life is going to use it

John Malanca  3:55  
in that's what I say you know, ailments disease does not discriminate and healthiest healthiest person in the world. Doesn't matter what your background is an ailment could could at any moment come any moment. But I think options and that's the part you know, I'm the first to say and even you and I are agreeing off camera. You know cannabis is not for everyone. And I'm the first to say that but at least give them option especially when you've been diagnosed with something as cancer. You have cancer. Your whole world just comes halting and you will try anything you know if someone says hey eat your eat your house, we seem to find a way to do it. Believe your mouth you know your notepad you will start you know start chewing on that as well. And so I think is great but I think helping break the stigma down. You know California has been legal since 1996. And I love how other states are improving when what we have done here because it was the wild wild west for years and when I jumped into this, you know, it has been night and day Compared to where it was then to where it is today and so and there's so many different you know, I learned every day and I know you were talking about that as well. And all the different cannabinoids, you what's the Collaborate, you know and so you start talking you know, I always say this about 140 Some people say 160 Some people say 113 But more and more being introduced each and every day. Don't do it CBD was V was you know, 10 years ago no one knew it CBN was five years ago no, no and then the acid form THCA CBDa but they all play a role in bringing the body back to

Kylee Shumway  5:34  
and we need all the pieces that need to happen have every piece so now

John Malanca  5:39  
with CBD and the hemp laws now it's legal. I say that everyone says all 50 States I think it's realistic What is it 48 states that that I think that's more real is that CBD is so there's still a gray area. It's 0.3% is legal limit of THC and in in the cannabis or the hemp plant I should say extract extract CBD and so you're able to purchase it online. Unfortunately you're able to purchase at your grocery store gas station 711 etc. Where I want to go and as time has gone on other products have come up that aren't aren't healthy spice Spice was another synthetic type of cannabis product, or THC product, I guess it mimicked THC but synthetic a lot of

Kylee Shumway  6:28  
it wasn't it wasn't truly shaped like THC. But it did fit into some of the same blocks. Yeah.

John Malanca  6:33  
And so people were when they're consuming were some cases unfortunately, dying, but also getting really sick. And so I think the government has cracked down on it. And this is last year. With the farm bill being passed a few years ago there was I guess there was a kind of another gray area in there. And another I guess product would you say derivative or would you say cannabinoids,

Kylee Shumway  6:57  
so it is a cannabinoid that occurs naturally in the plant, just not in quantities high enough to make it good for extraction.

John Malanca  7:06  
Gotcha. So what Kylee is talking about we're going to discuss is what is delta eight? And can you share with Delta eight is when I say like delta nine THC, what I also say delta eight THC, or I mean, there's so many

Kylee Shumway  7:22  
is delta eight THC. So shape exactly like delta nine THC, the shape is all of the same. But if you look at it, you can see that one of the double bonds in one of the Rings is in a different position. And that is it, there's a different double bond, your body doesn't actually know the difference. Truly it will, it will throw it at all the same locks, all the same receptors, that delta nine would fit into the differences, bonding affinity, so how strongly it grabs on to the lock, how long it fits in that lock. That's the difference.

John Malanca  8:02  
So when we say when you say shape I know you're talking about but for our audience, can you share what you're talking about? When you're in your say shape with

Kylee Shumway  8:09  
so it's like the shape of the molecule, every molecule is shaped different. And it's just that the shape of the actual molecule is exactly the same as delta nine with a different ring bond. So it just is. I wish I had a little picture for you.

John Malanca  8:25  
Yep, maybe we can pop it up on the screen. Yeah, we edit this. But Delta nine Delta nine THC is what we're seeing out in

Kylee Shumway  8:32  
the end. That's what everybody thinks of as, as cannabis. They think of that delta nine, that's that really heavy psychoactive feeling that you feel that's that delta nine, and delta eight is shaped exactly the same as that one with a different double bond. And that is that is so its bonding affinity is just a little different.

John Malanca  8:50  
And so does Delta me what is the purpose of Delta does Delta eight give the give us the same benefits of Delta nine. And it's what about the psychoactive effects of Delta eight versus delta nine.

Kylee Shumway  9:02  
So it does give a lot the same effects as delta nine, but it gets kicked off of the receptor faster. So it feels less psychoactive. When I think it's just psychoactive different, I would think of it as different so it doesn't bind a strongly in the central nervous system. So that heavy head high that everybody associates with Delta nine, where it bonds really well is actually in the peripheral. So like in the trunk of the body. You have a lot of CB two receptors in the trunk of your body around your organs. And so that is where delta eight has best action that's where a binds the best. So you'll get a lot of patients that come in and they feel like it's a body high they call the body high and and that's because that's where it binds the best is in the trunk of the body in the in the middle and around all of your organs and everything so it's really good for inflammation In the gut, so Crohn's disease, ulcerative colitis, the eye the irritable bowel diseases, all of those nausea, so really great antiemetic effects from Delta eight and delta eight is found naturally in the plant. So I just like want to be really clear about that, that it is found naturally in the plant.

John Malanca  10:22  
So it's not it's not a synthetic form, I wouldn't call

Kylee Shumway  10:25  
it synthetic. There's a lot of gray area with what we call synthetic and what is synthetic, we do not synthesize it, but it is naturally occurring in the plant.

John Malanca  10:38  
You know, I'm probably getting ahead of myself here because, okay, the the FDA, you know, you see both the pros and cons, I think and everything, especially with what's going on today. Vaccine safe, not safe, mass safe, not safe, you know, traveling safe, not safe. And now with delta a, even the on the FDA website, it, of course, has all the warnings on there. And so, you know, so I do see a lot, it's not safe, it's extraction methods, people are getting sick. And you're seeing a lot of this with a lot of 18 and under. Now, is that because is it legal in all 50 states? And do you need to have a doctor's recommendation for

Kylee Shumway  11:17  
it. So it's not legal in all 50 states, I think there's 18 states right now that outright have banned it, because it is so hard to regulate, because of the Farm Bill. It has, it's it's this huge gray area, and states are tired of trying to regulate it. So they're just banning it outright. And and part of it may be that they don't understand what the CDC and the FDA has actually come out and said it's not the Delta eight molecule itself, that is problematic for humans. It is the byproducts of the synthesis in markets where it's not regulated. So I can speak for Utah, specifically, in the dispensaries in the pharmacies here in Utah, we are heavily regulated. When we make a Delta nine product in the pharmacy. Yeah, we have to it has to be 95% Pure, it has to go through testing, it goes through mass spec gas chromatography. So all of these machines that help us see what's actually in there, I can see what actual molecules are in whatever I'm testing with these machines. So if they're not 95%, pure, we can't sell it in the pharmacy. But if you go to the gas station, or if you go to the CBD shop down the street, they're not under the same regulations because of the Farm Bill. Gotcha. So they're not being tested. And I have in my pharmacy, I have all the certificates of analysis that show what showed up on the testing, and I can produce those at any time. Beautiful. So it's a very, it's two different worlds. It's that regulated world. And then it's that totally unregulated people are making it in their basement or whatever they're doing. That's where the true problem lies is in those byproducts. Because you do use a catalyst. So you do use an acid to change the bonds that you need to. And if those aren't washed out properly, if you don't get rid of those properly, they can leave harmful byproducts behind so it's really important if you're going to Delta eight that it comes from a regulated market.

John Malanca  13:30  
So a lot of the I guess the benefits that are listed so not on the FDA, but other websites benefits. They're very similar to the benefits of Delta nine THC, they are not but also CBD. So why would someone take a chance of taking a non regulated product delta eight versus a product that you carry? You're in dispensaries, THC product does CBD product or any other cannabinoid? But you have certificates analysis? If I'm hearing you correctly, you don't you do not carry Delta eight and your we do? Oh, you do?

Kylee Shumway  14:06  
We do. But it's all regulated. And it's 95% Pure? Oh, well, we carry Delta eight products in the pharmacy. Yeah, I can prove that there's none of those byproducts left behind. There's no acids left behind in there. There's no other there's nothing else in there that's not supposed to be in there. It's only in like the gas station in the CBD shop where they don't have those and they don't have to have the same testing that we do.

John Malanca  14:33  
So you do see benefits and we do

Kylee Shumway  14:36  
I use it for lots of patients that have the Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis, the nausea, people that have had colon cancer where they're they're sick a whole lot. Patients that just are nauseous and we don't know why. Yeah. And it makes it in it because it's a little bit less psychoactive in the central nervous system. You can use delta eight and then go to work and go on with your day. And you don't have to be super high to get the benefit and which is true across the board for cannabis. You don't have to get really high to have the benefit from cannabis.

John Malanca  15:14  
I share that all the time when people come to come to us and they say I want the medical portion. Yeah. And so a lot of people's mindset the medical is CBD. THC is recreational

Kylee Shumway  15:26  
which is a horrible misconception

John Malanca  15:28  
totally. And I share that, you know, my brother has been in the wine business for 30 years and I say you know, it's like going wine tasting you can have a sip. You're okay you're three bottles you're gonna be intoxicated the same THC so you don't have to do this THC you can do 123 3 million. Exactly which I am a big fan of. So I'm sure I'm here. Okay. I don't that's the part I mean, I always hear that the the cons about delta delta nine. So I was like that with with the hemp market when it came in, because everybody in their mother came in and you just saw a bunch of crap excuse my language.

Kylee Shumway  16:07  
It is it was a lot of like, they couldn't prove what was in there. They couldn't show that they were making what they were saying. And it's that all over again. It's it's people making products that are not tested properly. And then it's the mislabeling then other really big thing that the FDA we had been talking about, were mislabeled products so people were going into these CBD shops they were buying what they thought was it were CBD gummies or something and then they were getting really high and they were reporting that and then the FDA has to report that as an adverse event because no one told this poor patient that there was delta eight THC in their gummy and so they were getting effects that there were unwanted they didn't want to be high. And there's an unregulated amount of Delta eight in some of these products they don't they don't have it on the packaging. So no one knows how much is in there.

John Malanca  17:01  
The you know what I've tried? I have a lot of companies that will send me products and many I try many I don't you know, and I and I will make sure they have leverage on but there's some products, some CBD products, and I'm totally blasted. And I'm thinking I call them with it. How is this possible? Oh, you must be sent and I know I'm sensitive but there's days I'll do in the daytime and there's a couple of products like I can't I can't even do this in the daytime trade show is that is that what

Kylee Shumway  17:33  
exactly what is that I could very well be what it is is a delta eight is in there and they've not told anybody because they don't have to.

John Malanca  17:43  
You can extract Delta eight from a hemp CBD plant as

Kylee Shumway  17:46  
well. So you moat that's mostly where delta eight comes from they will use so they're all Cannabis sativa but we'll call them we'll call them ones that are higher in CBD and lower in THC hemp for ease. From these hemp plants we extract the CBD and then they go through this process where we change that new change CBD into delta eight THC and it's as simple all we got to do is close a ring it's a it's a pretty simple process. And it's why it's so popular in these markets because it's so easy to do. And then you get a product that you know some people love because they get they can get high and some people are like oh my gosh I'm high and I hate this who made this Why isn't this the CBD gummy that I thought it was? So it's a pretty simple process to change CBD into delta eight THC.

John Malanca  18:38  
So does this benefit the patients that live in illegal states that are CBD only states or don't have any medical lock? No cannabis laws? Absolutely. They're turning to this say okay, I can still I can

Kylee Shumway  18:54  
still get some relief here. It's not exactly the same as delta nine but it's it's a lot of the same benefit as delta nine with a little less psychoactivity I wouldn't call it not psychoactive Yeah, I think it's about depending on the person it's about 80% So it's really close to the same psychoactivity

John Malanca  19:16  
so you know a lot of the benefits of Delta eight you see the same thing you do C and CBD though pain relief, stress relief, anti inflammatory, helps with appetite, health and wellness balance,

Kylee Shumway  19:30  
cuz your endocannabinoid system is in charge of homeostasis mood,

John Malanca  19:35  
as well as cramps and so you're talking about the gut as well. The whole trunk Yep. And so so I just I don't know I think to be safe just from what I'm hearing, is it safer for patients to go with a C tested CBD product? Are you feeling competent enough? That would like you said in your in your dispensary?

Kylee Shumway  19:56  
dispensary. I would give delta eight no problem not a concern for me. I would never send a patient on the street to the CBD shop to get delta eight.

John Malanca  20:06  
Gotcha ever. Yeah, the ones that are popping up right now I kind of Route people away from them for for that reason. And so with Delta eight It doesn't sound like you need a cannabis recommendation from a doctor or medical expert

Kylee Shumway  20:21  
in the states where they haven't banned it yet. Okay. And so

John Malanca  20:25  
how long is it? So are people using it consuming it the same same type of method via inhalation? topicals gummies. Gotcha. So there's a whole other market that's that's promoting the, the Delta eight it's funny, it really hasn't taken off in California like it probably has in other states. You know, just because I think everyone has that

Kylee Shumway  20:48  
it has to in California, you can get whatever you want. In California, which is great.

John Malanca  20:54  
So how you know people always say that, like, back in the day when you needed a doctor's recommendation. It was the joke. Oh, I have a hangnail Can I get a doctor's recommended? There you go Kylee. Oh, I have hiccups here you go Kylee.

Kylee Shumway  21:08  
It's when we ban things that everybody turns to this kind of gray market this this back alley they and they have to because they have to have treatments.

John Malanca  21:17  
So let me just pinpoint I never thought Delta was was safe but hearing you it's good to hear that. But the things they should look out for are tested products. Yes, eight products that do have the certificate of analysis also known as CO ca. Like other cannabis products, I always say if something's six months or older try to get a new newer newer product.

Kylee Shumway  21:41  
Because they degrade they the the cannabinoids go through a degradation process, and especially THC will turn into CBN overtime,

John Malanca  21:50  
which is another cannabinoid, which is another cannabinoid? Yes,

Kylee Shumway  21:53  
you whatever you've got will make you much more sleepy. Delta eight right now, the research shows that delta eight, the molecule is safe for human consumption. Well, it's all of the other pieces. That could be the problem. It's it's the products of the synthesis that could be a problem. Because I don't know what they made their Delta eight with. I know what we make our delta eight with I know what my partner's make their Delta eight with. And there's different ways to do it. You don't always have to use an acid catalyst. With enough time and enough pressure and enough heat, you can make delta eight THC without using an acid. But you know, it would take some some pretty sophisticated equipment, which

John Malanca  22:41  
which which is which is happening. And so how is it made you? Are they using co2 extraction, butane, ethanol, what are they

Kylee Shumway  22:49  
doing co2 extraction that's really popular in Utah right now. It's probably the most popular in Utah.

John Malanca  22:56  
What do you thought? I mean, sorry to cut you off there. No, supercritical co2 extraction was very popular, and 2010 2011 2012. And then a lot of other companies came in and said, Well, you're stripping the chlorophyll out of the plant. And so you being a cannabis expert, and working with patients. And what are your thoughts of that?

Kylee Shumway  23:20  
So there are places I don't want chlorophyll. I wouldn't want chlorophyll in my vape cartridge. I would prefer if that wasn't a heated up and inhaled. If you'd chlorophyll in a teacher, there's no there's no problem. I don't know if there. I wouldn't say that chlorophyll is part of the entourage effect. So while I think chlorophyll is great, and we should have chlorophyll, we should make sure we eat lots of leafy greens and all of that. I don't know if it's one of the most important components in your cannabis. It's so

John Malanca  23:57  
for our for our new listeners that you know every every day like you said ailment does not

Kylee Shumway  24:09  
doesn't discriminate, it doesn't discriminate.

John Malanca  24:10  
So every day we have people you know, being diagnosed with something in there, unfortunately, Googling everything now. So can you you just mentioned the endocannabinoid system. So you just give it like a maybe a cliff notes with just

Kylee Shumway  24:25  
the endocannabinoid system is a series of receptors throughout your whole body. They are in your brain and they are in every system in the body, the

John Malanca  24:37  
in all mammals in all

Kylee Shumway  24:39  
mammals, not just humans. So they're they're in all mammals. And they are what is kind of in charge of a lot of your homeostasis. They send the signals to your brain to do all of the things that the body kind of needs to do. And our body makes its own type of cannabinoids anandamide is the big one that you We're always hear about, but cannabis can act like those so the cannabinoids in cannabis can fit into that same block that your body's anandamide would fit into. So it's going to act a lot like that. I guess that's my, that's the simple way I could put that is quite a complicated system, but

John Malanca  25:19  
I always do a cliff cliff note version. Yeah, people are like, I don't get it. And I say, well, clickdo version is our body's recently discovered in the 90s, that we all have an endocannabinoid system. They're even saying now, everything that has a vertebrae that

Kylee Shumway  25:36  
we're finding more and more have CB one and CB two receptors.

John Malanca  25:40  
And I heard sea slugs now you have them. And so you know, but I guess everybody needs the same bound. But what that is the endocannabinoid system and cliff note version, what does it craving cannabinoids can bring the body back to balance. And as I mentioned earlier, you know, you don't have to be high to have to have to see the benefits. One thing I'm sure I've talked, you know, in for regular listeners, you know, a lot of presentations, I'll have a roll of duct tape behind me on my presentation and people laugh. They're like, Hey, John, do you have the wrong slide? And I said, put that up there. Because people always ask does it work for this? Does it work for this, and I don't want to say it has the same uses 101 1,000,001 uses like duct tape, and you really get down to it. The benefits of that just plant does offer and again, it's not for everybody, but the science and benefits behind this plant. It will blow your mind on what what it can can do. You know, to me, saving a life is is is how we came out of the gate. For others. I sleep better John, I'm able to go to the bathroom without pain, I'm able to see I'm able to get off my opioids, I'm able to bring my stress and anxiety down. And so, you know, again, it's not for everyone, but at least giving patient options.

Kylee Shumway  26:59  
We have so many important antidepressants. Yeah, one antidepressant doesn't work for every single patient. And it's the exact same thing in cannabis. And not every patient needs cannabis. Yeah. And then not every patient needs the same cannabis. It's not a one size fits all. And it's why I've loved that pharmacists are so involved with it here is because we are so accessible, your pharmacist is so accessible. The appointments with me are free, you can come and see me as many times as you need to. And we can work out what's working and what's not working for you. Just you even if you know I have to have the same person, exact same disease, they need a different treatment. Thank you. Oh, every time.

John Malanca  27:46  
So this one comes up all the time. John, how long will it stay in my system? And so how long will this stay in my system one and then two. Kylee is Delta eight, showing up on a drug test,

Kylee Shumway  28:01  
unfortunately does show up on drug tests. So the metabolite is really I think it's pretty much exactly the same. So most drug tests that are testing for THC, you're testing for the metabolites that are left over after the liver kind of does does its job. And delta eight leaves the same metabolite. So it will show up in a drug test. But you know, with hopefully, with the way that we're going, people will stop. I don't, I don't, we should just stop testing for THC. That's my opinion, here I am on this podcast telling everybody that and here we go. And then it stays in your system. So if you are it's a it's a huge range, it could be two days, it could be 30 days, two days for for light use. So you don't use very often. And this is delta eight specifically. So it's about two days. If you really liked us, you don't use very often in 30 days if you're using really heavily. So there's a huge span. And then it comes down to what liver enzymes you have like how much of the certain liver enzyme that you need to break down delta eight Do you personally make and what's your body composition? There's a whole bunch of factors. I wish I had the exact Yes, this is the black and white answer but that's not how medicine ever works.

John Malanca  29:22  
Boy so true. You know, you mentioned about going to the liver and stuff like that. That earlier. We spoke about the different forms that delta eight comes in. What would you what do you see with patients? I know onset some patients who are in pain want to use ingestion message via smoking or vaporization and others prefer tincture or less, you know a little more discreet.

Kylee Shumway  29:50  
i A lot of my patients love tinctures because they look so medical, and they love that and they're really comfortable with that. So capsules and tinctures. They look really medical and so a lot of my older patients or patients that are a little more nervous, they love those just because they feel safe. I like layering. So using a tincture or an edible. So you can have long relief six or eight hours depending on your body. And then layering in an inhalation form, when you have breakthrough pain, or you need pain relief, right now, it's not for everybody, but a lot of my patients have really, really good luck with that kind of like layering and but it takes some trial and error. It's always trying trial

John Malanca  30:37  
and error. You know, a lot of this is safety. So you're not for that. And, you know, a lot of patients will say, John, I wake up after I take us this CBN product. And I say, you know sometimes when you wake up depending on and that's what I do, like if I wake up and it's midnight, or one compared to 4am You know, if I get up to go the restroom. I'll take another dropper CBN. Go back to sleep. Yeah, cuz that's 20 minutes. Totally. And so I just go right back and fall asleep. Here's one with Delta eight, with the laws being gray area. Is a patient able to travel outside of their state legally with Delta eight, or is that not have the has that not been? No, it's a

Unknown Speaker  31:19  
I wouldn't know. Mostly because the if you got pulled over, they won't know the difference. Okay?

Kylee Shumway  31:32  
They don't know the difference. If you go into a state where it's banned, I not worth it. My big don't cross state lines of cannabis. I don't care what kind it is. Don't cross state lines are federally illegal, don't just don't cross the lines.

John Malanca  31:53  
So if traveling, see if it's legal in the state you're traveling to, and and go there.

Kylee Shumway  32:00  
And the laws are changing really fast. Right now Texas had Texas was the most recent one I can think of they were just in October, they were having a big fight of whether they were going to ban it or not. And they just recently and we're like that is it, it's banned. It's over. Wow. So

John Malanca  32:15  
Texas, I hear I hear more horror stories in the state of Texas, you in the rest of the states in our nation. And it's just a point, you know, just just because, I mean, you're talking offline, but with my father in law, the success I saw my father in law, you know, this discussion of cannabis would not have come up if we did not live in California in a legal state. And it's sad to hear others that don't live in a legal state, and it comes up and they don't have legal access. And so that's the part that is disappointing, like you shared with your boyfriend at the time, you know, we may be leaving you moving, we're moving, you know, and a lot of patients do that, you know, the cannabis refugees, and when they do get up and leave, you know, not only leaving your community, your families, your jobs, your doctor who already knows your whole background Kylene and you start over and you start over, but a lot of families are forced to do that. And, and, you know, over the past 12 years of being in this industry, you know, I've I know of a lot of families that have left. Not all were successful. I have a dear friend, they move from Georgia to California. And they're doing extremely well. And they said we get it for the eldest child, that's a mom and the family now loves visiting from Georgia, California and they just say, you know, our life has changed and you know, seen the true benefits of this plant. But again, do your research, make sure all your products are tested. If you're able to and your Utah stop by wholesome and see me, you know, have a one on one with Kylee and just get some guidance. I think I truly believe a medical professional should be involved. Just because you hear me talk about this all the time. It's not a one size fits all age, weight, current health conditions, sensitivities, as well as drug to drug interactions, as well as other modalities you may be on and so other patients that are going through something God forbid as cancer but chemo radiation, you can use a cannabis product side by side is not going to zero anything out. It will help it does have the benefits of not only healing, nausea, appetite, mood, you know, and again, hopefully bringing the body back to balance

Kylee Shumway  34:34  
and that mood, the mood you mentioned that's quality of life. Yeah, that's you already have to go through this horrific thing, especially with cancer boy, you can improve the quality of your life by increasing the mood I it's amazing the things that I get to see every day,

John Malanca  34:53  
every day and that's the thing and to hear the patients that come back and say oh my gosh I just thought this was going to be my way life forever. And now I feel better. And so, you know, pain is not a way of life and you're able to, you know, get out and try something and find something. Stress and anxiety. I'm a major advocate of getting outside and working out. And that helps bring my stress, anxiety, find what works best for you, if cannabis is it, and we're including it into your daily routine, and it's working fantastic. But I truly believe a medical professional should be evolved. Don't be afraid to ask questions. Even if you live in a illegal state, it's not illegal to ask those questions. Your doctor is not well versed on the benefits of this plant or the endocannabinoid system, ask them if they can refer you to someone in their Rolodex that May and I guarantee with 2021 Almost ending here, your doctors know somebody in their circle who knows about cannabis. If it's a doctor, nurse, or it's a pharmacist. Yeah, so, Kylee, before we leave, can you just give a little cliff note version of pros and cons of Delta eight one last last time.

Kylee Shumway  36:10  
So cons may not be made well may not be on the packaging. Those are the big the big cons and it's not a psychoactive. Some people see that as a con. Some people see that as a pro. Pros of Delta eight are decrease psychoactivity for the people that don't want them works great in the trunk. So really fabulous for inflammation all over the body, but especially in in the trunk. So even back pain. Holy cow. I forgot to mention that earlier. But back pain, Crohn's disease, ulcerative colitis. And then I think that's, that's those that's the Cliff Notes.

John Malanca  36:55  
Show trunk trunk in the body, not in the car.

Kylee Shumway  36:58  
Yeah. trunk on the body. And so that's Reagan. I don't want to call it like something too. Yeah. I don't want to get to, I don't know, I want to speak to people on the level that they're on.

John Malanca  37:09  
You know, and I think that's the best way to do it. You know, being able to not talk until a child through they're just looking at a deer in the headlight, you know, and explaining that's why I used to Cliff no version of college, you know, endocannabinoids system. What's it what's it looking for cannabinoids, and cannabinoids come in all shapes and forms, but you know, and they're all they all play it play a part and play a role. And so, Kylee, I can't thank you enough for coming on. And thank you, I would love to get you back on I'd love to talk about pain. I'm talking about drug to drug interactions, and going from there. So we'll make that it will make that a date in the in the near future to get you back up here. But how can people find you?

Kylee Shumway  37:54  
You can go on my website, it's wholesome.co. And I am all over there. And you can call us you could make an appointment? Um, I'm pretty easy to find.

John Malanca  38:08  
So Utah, so is Utah. So I'm California, if I came to Utah, would I have access to your dispensary? Or do I need a medic would

Kylee Shumway  38:20  
I would, you would so we finally got the law all taken care of and in place where if you have a medical card from another state, you can come here, you can go on the State's website. So that's cvs.utah.gov. And you can put your medical cards information in there and you can get a temporary card here. I'm not 100% sure how long they last. I think there's some limits on it. But you can get a card here and you can actually come and see me in my pharmacy.

John Malanca  38:50  
So for the patient show like myself, California being the adult use 21 and over same thing with Colorado, Oregon, Washington. No need for cannabis cards here. recommendations coming to your state, I would not be able to come in there.

Unknown Speaker  39:04  
You would not have to have a card.

John Malanca  39:07  
Okay. Okay, that's good to know. And it's is it can they get a card like the online things, or does it have to be an official excuse me state approved card with the state could

Kylee Shumway  39:20  
for I think they'll take any medical card from a state where it's legal. Gotcha.

John Malanca  39:28  
Okay. So um, you know, and I will share with everyone to, you know, go to your department of health of your state and IRS and type in medical cannabis division or medical marijuana division, and they'll have a list of laws, as well as recommending physicians not, they're not always up to speed when it comes to the science and the endocannabinoid system. They did take a course. But I think it's education starting education, and I always talk about the pebble in the pond with the ripple effects again, the education That's why we do do shows like this and so, Kylee Shumway what's the name? And you can find her@wholesome.co If you're in Utah stop by the dispensary in which city is in in in

Kylee Shumway  40:13  
Utah. We're in Bountiful so just a few minutes away from Salt Lake City.

John Malanca  40:17  
Gotcha. bountiful. bountiful. So, everyone, thank you very much Kylee for being on. John Malanca with United Patients group. Be informed and be well and we will see you soon. Have a great great day everyone. Bye bye